Project Categorization will be coming to J!Forge

[mediawizard]

Oh - and the projec categorization system will help promote active projects and relagate inactive projects to the netherworld.

boomzilla, dont mean to sound ungracious, however, we could do with some help with the J! Source Forge now

at last count there were over 250 projects - if we can see whether they have any file releases, and if they do a name/release type [some ppl have put up screenshots of upcoming templates for crying out loud] on the main project page would save a lot of time for all of us here

once again, thx for all your help, rgds

1. It would be great to be able to link separate files to different categories.
2. If you can only categorize the "project" then my advice would be to create a new project for every initiative.

1. would be great, that way would not have to spend time adding new projects
2. If thats the way to go, will do so, once we get a firm response

have a flash game component i want to release asap, any advice is welcome

[micheas]

There are a few ways that it would be very nice to be able to search the forge:

• By license. (At least Debian compliant license and non-Debian compliant license.
• in subversion yes/no
• Zip file available for download Yes/No
• by name!!
• by type: component/module/bot/template
• by function
• by community rating.
  

basically go to freshmeat.net and you will see my ultimate wish list but this would make it some what useful.

[crash777]

well I have been on the "forge" for the last two hours.. unfrotunately, most of that time has been spent sifting through the new projects without files...

We really need a way to see instantly from the main project page the category the file release is in - i.e No Files/Planning, Alpha, Beta, RC, Stable, Mature. Along with that, we need to make sure that project leaders fill that out properly (thus the need for a feedback method).

We also need a way to feedback to say, a site/category moderator that will enforce the simple design on the forge to allow for an optimal experience for everyone.

We need a way to monitor projects no matter if files have been released. I was successful in monitoring some projects but got to thinking on how I was going to have to check to see if any files have been released for the projects that do not have files currently.... I can't think of a way other than sifting through all projects (or all new projects).

[micheas]

We really need a way to see instantly from the main project page the category the file release is in - i.e No Files/Planning, Alpha, Beta, RC, Stable, Mature. Along with that, we need to make sure that project leaders fill that out properly (thus the need for a feedback method).

Don't forget abandon/needs maintainer as a project status.

[dsheppard]

I'll throw this out: naming standards.

The old de facto standard - com_xxx, mod_xxx, bot_xxx - was helpful in sorting by function but led to trouble in keeping things together on my drive as I needed to both remember that a certain component required one or more module or bots, and what they were named.

I think reversing this - xxx_v1_0_com, xxx_v1_0_mod, xxx_v_1_0_bot - would better help me keep files together on my drive, and enable me to review the files and versions at a glance.

I'm all for hiding projects until they have an actual release. I don't understand 'reserving' a forge project name or any such. Going to an empty project just give me bad vibes for the whole thing. It smells amateur.

[mediawizard]

Hmm, thats a great idea dsheppard

I create seperate folders for coms, mods, bots and templates I download
Though in spite of this some stuff gets mixed up as not all ppl followed the system

This seems to be a more efficient system
xxx_v1_tpl for templates?

[crash777]

I agree that a naming convention should be followed however I am teetering between which way I like best..

Adding the "com", "bot", "tpl", and "mod" BEFORE the file allows you to group all files by TYPE. But having the NAME first would allow you to group by release. Both ways have definite benefits and cons...

Personally, I have always liked using the com/bot/tpl/mod as a prefix because I stored them in separate folders. IF a project had multiple types I would store THEM into a separate folder called "packages". Not real organized sometimes because even them with the com/mod prefixes, the releases would not be together in a list.

The only other option that I can see would be non-dependent upon the naming and store any releases in folders organized by project name. The reason I bring this up is because is someone makes a galler component, someone else might make a bot in a separate project (i.e community builder has plenty of 3rd party developers releasing projects) so to store them with the com/bot as a prefix might become cumbersome....

In conclusion... maybe it is just the way many of us organize the files. We have been "trained" to separate out by component, bot, module, template... Do we impose a different naming strategy or a different organizing strategy? 

[dsheppard]

Adding the "com", "bot", "tpl", and "mod" BEFORE the file allows you to group all files by TYPE. But having the NAME first would allow you to group by release. Both ways have definite benefits and cons...

Well, I guess I would say that the current strategy forces me to organize by type, when I want to organize by product. I find no value in scattering the necessary parts of an addon about the drive (or directory) and then having to go back and sniff them all out again, when I have the opportunity to do an install.

A better strategy would be to enable the installer to accept the addon package as a single .zip with all parts inside and do the sorting for me. But that hasn't happened, yet - though it's been hinted at in the mystical Nirvana of version 5 2.

[crash777]

That will be a good thing but for now... I could live with either method... right now, however, not everyone is following either method... it is a little confusing but I found if I need to, I just rename the zip file as I download and that takes care of that 

[fatflash]

I'm all for hiding projects until they have an actual release. I don't understand 'reserving' a forge project name or any such. Going to an empty project just give me bad vibes for the whole thing. It smells amateur.

Yes. But it's an "open sourced" world out there.
What if people like me, new to this environement and with  little Joomla Skills and little time to spend, want to open a project and ask for help?
My real problem is that no one answered my call for help.

One good thing to have would be a Wanted section, either on the Forum or on the Forge itself.
I need help to translate my ideas into a component, a well done one, that's why I opened it before I had files to put there.

Also, no rant here, what's the problem of having "amateurs" developing for Joomla? They can have good ideas...

But I agree with everyone here, kill fluff marketing.

Cheers.

[crash777]

I think "amateurs" do contribute alot! I am one in many areas still! However... There should be some uptraining required in order to use a software forge. Many people do not know how to use one and misclassify, mislead and misrepresent their project. Maybe not intentionally but nevertheless.... it happens. Looking for help should be done in the forum... post a thread here. I am sure the question will be accomodated. Making a new project as practice then asking for help and then making everyone wait 6 months before you post a file is meaningless... I believe, however, that one should have a "right" to be able to do this if they desire BUT it should be classified correctly so I can avoid the project until there is something there to download.

On another note..(and the reason I came back here just now)... I wanted to post on the fact that there is no "last updated" date column. I was on the forge looking for new files but also for newly updated files and cannot figure out how to look for newly updated files.

[fatflash]

Looking for help should be done in the forum... post a thread here. I am sure the question will be accomodated.

Well... I need It on JoomFAQ.

Making a new project as practice then asking for help and then making everyone wait 6 months before you post a file is meaningless... I believe, however, that one should have a "right" to be able to do this if they desire BUT it should be classified correctly so I can avoid the project until there is something there to download.

That's ok. I already had other projects, PT Joomla Translation, which already have Files.
What I should be able to do is have a Dev area where I could create and manage my projects (overseen by Joomla! Forge Managers  or not, I don't care) and be able to show them or hide them as I wished.
Too much to ask? I kinda liked GFORGE as opposed to SourceForge, But if there can be improvements, let them come.

[dsheppard]

Making a new project as practice then asking for help and then making everyone wait 6 months before you post a file is meaningless... I believe, however, that one should have a "right" to be able to do this if they desire BUT it should be classified correctly so I can avoid the project until there is something there to download. 

I can agree with that. On further reflection, the forge is probably being forced to do things that it was not intended to do. As a development aid, it's probably very useful. As a file repository (the role we've really been discussing), it's not as well-suited as a dedicated filebase, I think.

Perhaps the forge and the release files should be separate, with projects moving off the forge to the filebase when ready.

[mediawizard]

A better strategy would be to enable the installer to accept the addon package as a single .zip with all parts inside

This feature is currently available in some components [esp commercial ones]

Perhaps the forge and the release files should be separate, with projects moving off the forge to the filebase when ready.

I think ur brilliant dsheppard and i'm quoting your thoughts quite a bit

however, sourceforge itself is used as a file repository by many,
it definitely has all the features which are required -
it just has to be implemented / duplicated here as well

And i'm quite sure that sourceforge would be a lot more advanced than gforge
its just that old habits die hard...

[crash777]

old habits do die hard... I think whomever is going to decide on this, needs to make a decision very soon. There are already over 340 projects.

[xplosion]

When will be coming Project Categorization to J!Forge ?

[mediawizard]

When will be coming Project Categorization to J!Forge ?

Has a date been set?

There are already over 340 projects.

393 now

[xplosion]

When will be coming Project Categorization to J!Forge ?

Has a date been set?

I don't know but for now is very confusing actually JForge, with many empty projects...
It was better ex *****Forge !

[Predator]

When will be coming Project Categorization to J!Forge ?

As i wrote in an other Thread:

To explain more, the "old" Sourceforge and the fork "gforge" have php as codebase.

The SFEE which we now have on developer.joomla.org is totally rewritten in JAVA to say it easy. Datatransportation works with SOAP.

VA and Joomla working on solutions to exchange the datas easily to got all needed infos on an Joomla frontend, to make it easier for all to get more infos. But this is not a task of a week, it will take some time. Collin is collecting all requests, but please be more patient, they really work as hard as they could.

So the issues are adressed and VA is working hard on it together with the Coreteam.

[mediawizard]

But this is not a task of a week, it will take some time. Collin is collecting all requests, but please be more patient, they really work as hard as they could.

So the issues are adressed and VA is working hard on it together with the Coreteam.

Ok, thanks for the update predator, hadnt seen your other post.
I'm sure VA and the core are putting in their best efforts
Getting the forge up in such a short span of time is in itself commendable

Will wait for updates

[serknor]

tell me if I am wrong...  :P

- Moderated categorization
- Users comments / Rating system
- Download counter
- Mis-categorized projects will be sanctioned, deleted or rejected...
- Project with a name and/or description that is meaningless/confusing rejected with request to resubmit with a better name
- Empty projects deadline: some months empty => project will be deleted, warning with an email
- Projects with no files do not show up to average users / Projects with less than X activity will not show up in the categorization list (modal)
- Sort/filter projects by download counter, popularity, votes, amount of files, project update time...
- Multiple categories / Separate files (or subprojects)  linked to different categories
- Report to moderator, abuse, mis-categorization, etc.
- Option to hide a project from the public by the project admin

[philmoz]

- Option to hide a project from the public by the project admin

This is already possible.
I am probably a little dense, but it took me 3 days to figure out that it wasn't visible to the public, and another towork out how to make it so...

Certainly agree with most of rest of your list.

Regarding names... a name phonetically written in english from, say Swahili, may be considered meaningless. If this is to be a criteria, a policy defining meaninglessness needs to be very, very clear.

[gsbe]

Much has been said here with good feature suggestions all around. I'd like to propose breaking up the development of the frontend for the Joomla Forge into two phases to make it easier to implement in a reasonable amount of time:

Phase 1: Categorization of function and features for the projects.

Phase 2: Rating and review system for projects. Most popular, most downloads per category, editor's picks, etc. I like Mozilla's UI for Firefox Extensions and Winamp's system for finding Plug-ins. They both have a heavy focus on user feedback in their display with similar emphases on number of downloads and user reviews/comments/ratings. They both also have a strong reliance on a categorization system by function/features. Winamp's use of "Top Staff Rated" is an important section. Official approval of some sort goes a long way in keeping standards high.

[Matthew Schultz]

I'm certainly an amateur developer. I myself have found frustration at seeing projects that are empty have a higher search score (same project concept) then the one active one I was working on. Perhaps some sort of email ping could be used? Maybe something like:

Are you still there? Its been six months since you activated your forge account. Please click the following link to keep you project active.

This way we could at least get rid of "filler" accounts without much guilt.

[jdstevenson]

First, I really appreciate everthing VA and all the devs are doing on Joomla...  But I'm really finding the new forge very frustrating and difficult to use when looking for CMM's.  And this comes not from a newbie, but from someone who's been around this project for 5 years, contributing a bit of code, and a bit of $ to the projects and causes that have kept $ambo and joomla going.

When I heard VA decided to help on the forge, I was cautiously optimistic.  I have a love hate relationship with sourceforge.  I use it heavily, and depends on it,  but finding things is impossible... I cringe at sending anyone there who isn't a hard core geek.  I'm hoping they can take the lessons from that and the old mamboforge to this project.

We need a button from the home site that says "Files and Addons" or something that indicates the amazing ways Joomla can be extended.  "Developers" might work for a landing page for people that are in fact developers -- but we've got to get a simple usable repository in place for the thousands of people that want to check out this project.

What's the status guys?  This thread has some great ideas, but I'm not seeing any movement... I keep coming back to the forge hoping things have changed, and keep clicking away to third party sites (or Google) to help me find what I want.

I hope this isn't seen as a complaint so much as encouragement, hope, and expectation. :-)  It's really important we get this working.

[Matthew Schultz]

We need a button from the home site that says "Files and Addons" or something that indicates the amazing ways Joomla can be extended.  "Developers" might work for a landing page for people that are in fact developers -- but we've got to get a simple usable repository in place for the thousands of people that want to check out this project.

Perhaps once they get categorization worked out the next Joomla release after that time can have a link to the dev. Maybe an introduction paragraph about bots and so forth and links to the forge.

[gsbe]

...I'm really finding the new forge very frustrating and difficult to use when looking for CMM's.

Until the forge's UI is working as well as we all hope, kenmcd's fabulous work is a saving grace for newbies and veteran Joommates:

• http://forum.joomla.org/index.php/topic,16398.0.html
  

[Matthew Schultz]

...I'm really finding the new forge very frustrating and difficult to use when looking for CMM's.

Until the forge's UI is working as well as we all hope, kenmcd's fabulous work is a saving grace for newbies and veteran Joommates:

• http://forum.joomla.org/index.php/topic,16398.0.html
  

Kens insane with those lists. The mans a bonafide listing machine.

[jdstevenson]

...I'm really finding the new forge very frustrating and difficult to use when looking for CMM's.

Until the forge's UI is working as well as we all hope, kenmcd's fabulous work is a saving grace for newbies and veteran Joommates:

• http://forum.joomla.org/index.php/topic,16398.0.html
  

Kens insane with those lists. The mans a bonafide listing machine.

Good God.  That's simply oustanding work...  Here's hoping the categories and listings they come up with do justice to Ken's great work.  They should make that post a link at the top of the main site... Thanks for the tip!

[Motoridder]

kenmcd, thank you from the bottom of my heart! 

Love that infos...