Mod Question - Joomla! Day UK - July 30th Thread Topic is solved

[AmyStephen]

I hope that it is acceptable that I be able to ask a tricky question politely in the forums and not have an angry or sarcastic or bullying response. 

What happened to the post that Vimes responded to in response #45 when he speaks of "wee" and that Brian indirectly responded to by responding to Vimes?

And, if that post was censored because it was considered OT to say that one wished she lived in England, then where is the record of its removal? And if the original post were OT, then why are not the responses not OT, as well?

Frankly, I like a little fun in the forums once in awhile -- it sure beats the stupid arguments that fire up around here from time to time. Silliness is good for community building, on occasion. I thought Vimes's response to be friendly to the person who was friendly enough to say the UK would be a great place to live. What was so bad about that? And, I thought Brian's response to be friendly, as well.

But, what would not be friendly, I am afraid, would be to enforce rules differently from person to person -- and even differently for those who were part of Mambo and those of us who joined you when you formed Joomla. And, if I am right about these inconsistencies, and I hope I am wrong, then, inconsistent enforcement of the rules is not a warm and welcoming message for our growing community and we need to take a second look at these actions.

It is important to be consistent, fair and transparent with these actions for all community members.

Again, I do hope it is acceptable to ask open questions here. Even if I am wrong, is it okay to ask if I ask in a polite fashion? I am simply confused and concerned. And, I have looked at this for awhile, now, and I just cannot shake that feeling.

There is probably a very simple explanation for this. I hope my concerns are wrong.

[brad]

Split from http://forum.joomla.org/index.php/topic,70869.0.html Off topic post.

If you must know Amy, the user was banned for spamming the forum elsewhere, and all their posts were removed. I personally deleted that post.

What exactly is the concern? Do you think there is some sort of conspiracy going on? Both Brian and Vince are big enough people that they can take care of themselves, I seriously doubt they feel targeted by any of the moderators, there is no need for you to moderate the moderators or try to speak for any user you feel is being hard done by...

I'm sorry if you are offended by my comments, but posting this in a thread about an event Brian is arranging, is totally off-topic, hence the reason I have split your post.

[infograf768]

I have banned that user yozzzzh for breaking forum rules (signature, advertising, OT, and spamming using Reported posts).

Do we have to report to you, Amystephen, all the decisons we take on this forum?

We have been flooded with spam and one-timer garbage posts in the last 2 months.
We do our job.

Please keep OT.

[AmyStephen]

There is not a moderator comment in that thread to indicate what happened to the deleted post. And, you are absolutely right – you can moderate how you choose without notifying or asking me anything. But, do not be surprised if people reach their own conclusions, absent information.

Conspiracy? Please, no drama! We take this all too seriously.

Sadly, however, you both made my point with your responses. And, I do mean sadly. But, even still! Let’s keep it in perspective. It is not life or death here. And you open the floor for a discussion I would like to have, so I appreciate that very much.

Make certain the passion used with your response equals the crime.

Look at my question and see how carefully worded it is and consider your responses. Were your responses carefully worded? Did you try to remove accusations, personal attacks, slams and sarcasm? Were my actions that horrible or damaging that those responses were appropriate? Was there another, perhaps more friendly way this could have been handled? Or, am I simply not allowed to ask?

We are not on equal footing, here, and I do not think you consider that point.

If you do not like what a community member says, our posts can be deleted and obviously, we can be banned. Those are not pleasant things to have happen. What you say about us with others in your group and the messages you determine are important enough to share with the core impact our reputations and set the stage for how we are treated.

It can feel very unfriendly here.

Please make certain questions raised by community members are at least given one courteous response. Frankly, how many times do you see me ask questions like this in the public forums? And, what would be wrong with me asking on a regular basis? Would you prefer I concoct my own “conspiracy theory” than determine the truth?

When other community members read this thread, will they conclude that Joomla! is a place where you are free to ask questions and raise concerns? And, if they conclude it is not, what does that say about our community climate? What direction are we heading in?

Lately, it seems like more and more things get blown out of proportion and this is no exception. This tells me you guys are frustrated and feeling under attack. I am telling you as a community member who logs considerable time and tries very hard to help the new people, I feel the same way. But it is not the community who I feel is attacking.

So, what do we do? How can we support you guys in your jobs and, at the same time, restore some amount fun and friendliness to our forums as we continue to do our job? Or, do you respect what we do as a job?

And, let’s take a quick look at this without all of the defensiveness. Surely, we can each implement small changes that will be helpful. And, it is not unusual to stop a moment and regroup every now and then. I know I have had to do serious thinking given issues raised with my OT posts. I am trying very hard to improve and still be who I am supposed to be. It is not easy but I am making an effort and I am moving in the right direction.

Brad – as an example of “small helpful changes.” Your signature is most unfriendly. "Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience." You are the top dog around here. You set the standard for friendly. Others emulate your behavior. I have noticed a few other moderator signatures are also unfriendly, now.

Does responding like that bridge the growing divide, or increase our problem?

Please make certain that you look as diligently and closely for positive things to say about what people do and that you are not overly focused at finding fault. It has been my experience that you find what you are looking for. So, look for good.

Start actively and publicly thanking community members for their efforts. Hopefully, you will eventually find yourself thanking more than disciplining. That will have a pervasive and positive impact on everyone's behavior! If you look at research on human behavior, especially with group dynamics, finding and holding up “good” is far more effective than snuffing out the bad.

Little things like that, guys. Let's not blow this sky high and make more of it than necessary. Let’s try to do what we can individually to make it more fun and productive around here for everyone. Let’s try to shrink the divide between us.

I have been very quiet in the forums when it comes to raising issues. I do believe, though, that it is time to start working on restoring the friendliness and fun that we seem to be missing more and more.

I have also raised the issue of word choice with a number of community members, as well, in how concerns are worded. IMO, people have been incredibly receptive to these comments and, when asked, nearly always change their wording so that it is friendlier. At that point, my comments are removed or I ask a moderator to delete my post. No one should be attacking you guys and I will stand up for that every time I see it. And community members are entitled to ask a question in a friendly and responsible way. And, they are entitled to a friendly, nicely worded response. And, I will stand up for that, as well.

We each have to make an effort – not just those of us without the badges but you who are in charge, as well. Typically, there are at least two sides to every problem and resolving it takes the desire and effort on both.

Thank you both for everything you do on the forums.

Brad, I have told you many, many times how impressed I am with your ability to take care of everything; you know so much about what goes on and I know you are faced with the worst of Joomla! and it is easy to get discouraged. And, I am so sorry for the crap that you face on a regular basis. You have a huge amount of responsibility and, I hope over time, we can move some of it to another set of shoulders and relieve you a bit.

JM – you are the wise soul, here. You are Joomla!’s conscience and you are unafraid to make even a lonely stand for what you believe is right. You always know how to quiet the storm and the diligent help you provide in the testing area, alone, is amazing. When I see someone like you responding the way that you did, I know you guys are feeling frustrated and attacked.

We are all on the same side here. I know you realize this and I know the answers are not easy and I understand that you are faced with so many challenges that I do not see. I can’t begin to thank you enough for what you do.

Now, on to good things! Let’s be positive. Let’s try to make it a little more friendly and fun here. Let’s be passionate about finding the good! We each have little changes we can make to start moving more closely together and improving the overall community climate.

Thanks for listening. Thanks for being confident enough in Joomla! to allow a dissenting voice. This is an amazing community that you all have assembled here and I am proud to be a part.